ADHD or atrocious parents?

That is so heartbreaking.The poor kid what’s he going to be like as a teenager or even an adult.The parents need a reality check.

That is shocking.

I didn’t know familes could get benefits if they get a diagnosis. That sounds like a system which familes would try and abuse rather a lot.

Onto the family in question, what awful parents. I don’t blame the kid in the slightest for storming off. I’d have done exactly the same thing. I don’t know much about psych let alone child psych but in my opinion ADHD is a hugely overused phrase by completely incomptent parents. Some of these people really don’t deserve to have children.

Poor kid

Ah, yes, I think we can all sit back and tut and judge these parents who, to my mind, seem to be at the end of their tether with their child. Sounds to me like they are exhausted, frightened, bewildered and confused by their son’s behaviour, to the point where they act in such an inappropriate manner.

He may be perfectly all right at school, he may present very well to the professionals in the CAMHS team while still being a complete and utter fucking nightmare at home. And it sounds as if the mother has tried to do the best thing, and it hasn’t worked.

This fact - that she has tried the parenting class - suggests to me that their outburst against their kid is a sign of their desperation rather than anything else. Clearly, they are in need of some support and perhaps it’ll take more than a couple of questionnaires and a school visit to find out what their needs might be.

I’m not saying what they said about their son was right, far from it. But I think it’s a sign that they need help, even if that can’t be provided by CAMHS. I think this situation also, to some extent, indicates the limitations of your assessment processes. Yes, they might just be bloody awful parents, but reading between the lines, that doesn’t seem to be the case.

I would make a referral to social services anyway.

Well, Z, it seems to me that at one point, they may well have thought it was them at fault, hence the parenting class. The intervention didn’t work, so they’re perfectly within their rights to surmise that there’s something more going on.

I guess I’m just cautioning against too much cynicism and judgementalism.

Well, this is always the problem with blogging - the context is either missing or incomplete.

I’m just of the opinion that parenting is one of the hardest jobs in the world. There is so much expectation placed on you, and so much blame laid on you if your kids are - shall we say - less than perfect. And yet, we leave it up to rank amateurs, intervening with ‘parenting classes’ only when things have already gone wrong.

Not only that, but I’d argue that the therapy/self-help industry has robbed parents of one of the best tools in their armoury: common sense. So great is the anxiety among some parents that they’re going to “get it wrong” and scar their child for life, that they are wary of acting on their own intuitive understanding of their child’s needs, instead deferring to largely self-appointed and often contradictory “experts” for parenting advice.

These parents don’t sound like totally bad people. If they really didn’t give a shit, they wouldn’t be accessing your service in the first place. They’d be ignoring the kid’s behaviour at best and belting him black and blue at worst.

…or like it was suggested they are just doing it for the disability living allowance?

I wonder to what extent that’s actually based in reality, faith

Hmm - well, I’ll take all that with a teensy-weensy pinch of salt if I may, for various reasons. However, my point was not that parenting classes aren’t any good but that they aren’t given at the right time. By the time the parenting classes come along people are a) already parents and b) already struggling.

So, what are you suggesting? Teaching parenting skills in schools?

Yes, as part of a broad-ranging education in sex, sexuality, relationships and personal/emotional/mental health and wellbeing.

Sorry Z - I’d have to agree with Beakie on this one.

And just an observation, those that tend to make these type of comments I think they simply want a label to pin on him, to prove that the problem is within him, and nothing to do with them. tend not to be parents themselves.

Parenting classes can be useful, but cannot account for that (small) minority of children who will rebel against their parents whatever. And these parents seem desperate enough to WANT some help and not just let ‘Danny’ terrorise them and possibly the neighbourhood as well. It’s not right that they say thos ethings about him (and certainly not in front of him) but I have been known to say similar (and I HAVE a clinical neurodevelopmental diagnosis for my son). Parents aren’t perfect - we don’t give every potetial parent a test to see how effective they are going to be and then sterilise the woman if they fail. Or perhaps we should - oooh opening a can of worms there!

Parenting in schools ????. And why, exactly, should that take precedence over first aid, personal finance, environmental issues, fire prevention and learning Latin. Where, exactly, are the spaces in the curriculum ?. Shouldn`t the focus be on the restoration of school discipline and ensuring each pupil has a grip of the 3 R`s.

Not sure these bottom up debates come up with any sensible conclusions. We do need more in terms of context and yes, I`m hugely intersted to know whether this family are in financial difficulty, whether they`re on benefits, whether they`re Danny`s biological parents ?. The pursuit of DLA does seem to be a Holy Grail for a growing number of people.

Taking the top down approach. If we placed more value on community and extended family, gave tax breaks for the nuclear family, stopped state sponsored chilbirth being so attractive ( take a bow, Karen Matthews. I note the compulsory sterilisation rock has been overturned in another thread and, frankly, in this instance, I`m tempted ) retrieved the criminal justice system from the comedy channel, restored school discipline and gave more support to youth organisations ( “he likes to play rough” = rugby club ) then I can`t imagine that we`d see so many Danny`s.

The problem here is that as soon as we try to say, “He doesn’t have ADHD, so let’s see what else could be the problem and how it could be addressed”, then we just hit a brick wall

Because what are you offering them? More of the same that they’ve already tried and that didn’t work. Is it any wonder they’ve put the shutters up?
OSB - on the one hand you bring up Karen Matthews as an example of someone from the dysfunctional underclass we’re producing in this country, then balk at the idea that parenting and other aspects of personal wellbeing should be taught in schools. Where do you think the Karen Matthews of this world come from? Central casting?

There seems to be plenty of space in the curriculum for largely useless tests that have done the square root of FA to improve standards and raise literacy and numeracy levels.

I think the “pursuit of DLA through the kid” notion is largely mythical because DLA isn’t that easy to get, there are plenty more hoops to jump through than getting a diagnosis and anyway, how many people are actually aware of CAMHS services before they take their kid to the GP because something’s awry?

WOW - my comment got marked as spam!!

Karen Matthews knows, damn well, that she is not experiencing repeated immaculate conceptions. Her major problem is not, in fact, her parenting skills. It`s whether she could apply whatever skills she had to her seven children while accommodating the wishes of the five fathers ( assuming they`re interested ). Karen Matthews is not deterred from this lifestyle as she knows, full well, that the State ( TAXPAYER !!!!! ) will, seemingly happily, assume the paternal role of provider. That is the problem. It is not a reflection of what she did / did not learn in school.

Yes, teachers have been distracted from doing what they`re supposed to do - teach in an orderly environment - by rubbish like “useless tests”. The consequence being ill educated school leavers. Remove the tests and restore the curriculum to what it was and we`re simply back to where we were. There`s still no room in the curriculum for sexuality, relationship blah, blah awareness.

While we`re gazing at our navels grappling with social science, media studies and Klingon, the Chinese and Indians are putting their children through their paces in maths, hard sciences and languages. We`re getting left behind and worse becoming international laughing stocks. Never mind eh, let`s just sit in a circle, hold hands and ponder our emotional wellbeing. Feel better already ?. I fuckin` don`t.

So it’s your belief that Karen Matthews is just inherently crap as a parent. Something in her genes, maybe? Or is it embedded in her neural structures?

“Restore the curriculum to what it was”? To what it was when? There was no national curriculum before Kenneth Baker instituted it in 1988, and it hasn’t exactly crowned itself with glory in the time it’s been in place. Endless political interference is the problem, not the subjects taught.

Did you know OSB, that there are more media studies graduates actually working in the media and related industries, and therefore contributing to the economy, than there are law graduates working in law? You won’t get any Daily Mail headlines about what a waste of time law degrees are, will you?

Don’t worry Beakie- I can’t use that comment box anymore because apparently my IP has been blocked. I wouldn’t take it personaly. ;-P

I don’t know if i agree with the idea of parenting classes in schools! But maybe if in these “PSE” (personal and social education)- if they still exist- sessions, more focus could be placed on life skills/social skills in general. Would that in turn create better parents? I’ve no idea. PSE classes were where I had my sex education and not a lot else. If they were utilized better i’m sure you could get something good out of it other than (appalling) sex ed.

Faith

If Karen Matthews had two children in a stable, preferrably marital, relationship then we would have a better chance of assessing her inherent parenting skills. As she opts to impregnate herself by every Tom, Dick and spotty fishmonger in Dewsbury, she will continue to be ommitted from my Christmas card list.

And which govenment department, at my expense, collates information on where media studies graduates find employment ? ( I thought the anecdotal evidence pointed to McDonald`s ). Isn`t the British film industry on it`s arse ?, Don`t we import the majority of children`s TV. I`ve got the full Sky package, it`s mostly crap. If you think Bid TV and the Bang Babes are going to hold up the economy in a recession you`re sadly mistaken.

As for comparisons with law degrees. I can only assume you`re having a laugh. I`m sure the Chinses ambassador is feverishly writing to Peking outlining how Claims Direct, and the no win - no fee pantomime, and Mrs Blair`s Human Rights gravy train are a mortal threat to Chinese economic domination.

Pre `88 there may have been no formal curriculum but parents knew what they could expect from their child`s education. I don`t recall much distress at the fact that I wasn`t abreast of transgender issues.

faith - sounds like your sex ed was slightly better than mine. Back in the 70s, we had one session where a red-faced student teacher bumbled through the reproductive system in double-quick time with no mention of relationships, being gay, sexual health etc etc.

And which govenment department, at my expense, collates information on where media studies graduates find employment ?

No government department, and not at your expense. This I was told by a professor at the Institute of Education. And by media, they don’t mean telly and films anymore, oldster, they mean all forms of media including the interwebs, mobile technology and the like.

You seem obsessed with the Chinese, who, incidentally, aren’t going to dominate the world through the quality of their schoolkids/undergrads/graduates but through the cheapness and volume of their products.

Pre `88 there may have been no formal curriculum but parents knew what they could expect from their child`s education.

Really? And what was that? And how did they know if it wasn’t formal? Honestly OSB, you’d be better off shedding that Daily Mail Colonel Huffington Puffington persona and stepping into the real world once in a while

I`ve never met a professor at the Institute of Education - whatever the hell that might be - I don`t get out much I`m too absorbed in the Daily Mail. However, please permit me a wild guess at what the good professor is unlikely to say, ” my God, we`ve been utterly moronic and trained far too many people in media studies, none of whom have a hope in hell of finding graduate level employment in the media industry.”. Your evidence is just as anecdotal and much less widely accepted than my McDonald`s jibe.

As for interwebs and mobile technology I can only humbly apologise. I hadn`t realised that Microsoft, Google and Cisco were actually based on the outskirts of Liverpool and that Nokia, Motorola and Sony Ericsson had their headquartes in Milton Keynes. I will take this matter up with the editor of The Mail, he`s not keeping me well enough informed for my 45 p a day.

For the record, the Chinese are already dominant through the cheapness and volume of their products. The important point is what happens when they ally this strength to the new generation of well educated mathematicians, scientists, engineers, linguists and the like. Don`t worry though we`ll know the difference between clap and chlamydia.

However, please permit me a wild guess at what the good professor is unlikely to say, ” my God, we`ve been utterly moronic and trained far too many people in media studies, none of whom have a hope in hell of finding graduate level employment in the media industry.”

I should have pointed out that the professor’s discipline was education, not media studies. He has no vested interest in bigging up media studies courses.

As for interwebs and mobile technology I can only humbly apologise. I hadn`t realised that Microsoft, Google and Cisco were actually based on the outskirts of Liverpool and that Nokia, Motorola and Sony Ericsson had their headquartes in Milton Keynes.

Erm - they may not be based there, but there are other companies who ARE, all of which will need, at the very least, a web presence. Some of them might even like a media studies grad to help them with marketing themselves internationally, online.

What makes you think we aren’t producing “well educated mathematicians, scientists, engineers, linguists and the like”?

Having an opinion is frowned on by the woolly minded elite, you must have evidence. But some things you just know. I was a handful at school, I was going to the Army come what may and didn`t need to focus on academia. I wasn`t thick by any means but I wasn`t in that top bracket who were obviously destined for university. That`s as it should be, the best minds need honing in university. Nowadays, everybody seems to go. I`ve no idea what they do but it must be tiring as thy all need a gap year to get over it. Their parents have a nice photo of them under a mortar board and the lucky graduate has an unimpressive five figures of debt. It`s been DUMBED DOWN, very obviously DUMBED DOWN. I work with double graduates whose English is poorer than the Zimbabweans who learnt English as a second language on a slate.

When I worked in a unit in the northwest of England, the local university had 400 students a year on the psychology course. I worked with one as she banked on my ward. She wasn`t stupid she knew she had to get a good degree to get a sniff of a job. Fair play to her she achieved first class honours. Did she get a sniff of a job ? She did actually, as a NA on my ward.

Incidentally, the local agricultural college which specialised in pig husbandry didn`t have one, not one, person on their course. I`m looking forward to first rate counselling as I die of malnutrition.

These kids are being betrayed by educational propagandists like you, Beakie and your mate the professor. The government is happy to collude as it keeps the unemployment figures down. These kids can`t get these years back. They`ll struggle with their debt burden for decades. They won`t get on the property ladder. I spent my late teens in a hedgerow in Co Fermanagh. It could be dull but the advantage was I didn`t have much to spend my money on. If you`re shrewd that can pay dividends in later life. A lot of students are missing out. I feel incredibly sorry for them.

Even Oxbridge are going down the pan. They`re more focussed on being inclusive and non - judgemental to bother with academic excellence.

And as for where the scientists, engineers and mathematicians have gone, kids take the easy option and just aren`t studying these subjects. Even worse boys are being denied the opportunity to disect things and cause explosions so they just aren`t switching on to science.

It`s you, your professors and your staff room who need to step into the real world

Hmm - interesting. You seem to be arguing in favour of some pre-20th century world where the poor knew their place and did pig-farming while the son of the lord up the road went up to the big town and did all that clever book-learnin’ in the hooniversity that’s not for the likes of us.

You seem also to have gone into full-on frothing rant mode, characterising me as an ‘educational propagandist’, whatever one of those is, alongside my ‘mate’ the professor who just happened to point out that media studies graduates are useful to the economy, contrary to the received wisdom of Paul Dacre and his merry band of hacks.

You also appear to think that this country has no brains anyway, no scientists, no mathematicians, no linguists worth the candle. What it must be like in your grim little world where everything is going to hell in a handcart and has been since 1900 is anyone’s guess.

Oh, and incidentally, I’m pissing myself laughing at the thought that I’m in “the elite”. I did a degree in mental health nursing while I was working full time in an acute psych ward. I teach at a post-92 uni with an inner-city campus that isn’t about to appear on the top of any league table any time soon. I don’t have a book-lined study with a view of the quad; I share a cluttered little office with four others in a barely-functioning glass and chrome 70s tower block with a view of the traffic. I probably make less in a month than an agency nurse on nights and the nearest I’ve got to the dreaming spires was a day trip to Oxford. I’m unsure whether my head of dept will agree to fund my masters this year. That’s all supposing I’m not given the boot in the next round of redundancies.

Elite? *restitches sides*

There is a liberal elite. You obviously are not as offended by them as I am. I did not suggest that you were a member of it. Lecturers hold no sway. You are an educational propagandist. Turkeys won`t vote for Christmas, you won`t acknowledge that a great deal of further education in this country is a waste of time. That`s understandable, I`m unlikely to say acute psychiatry is a fool`s errand.

The politics of envy are little more than laughable these days. Warren Buffett and Bill Gates suggest to me that we live in a global meritocracy. “The Lord” and the multi - millionaire will always be able to buy a good education for their progeny. If they`re prevented from doing it here they`ll go abroad. Life isn`t fair. Get over it or become John Prescott.

What is actually important is ensuring that everyone gets a good, basic education and the finer minds, wherever they come from, progress. I don`t, for one second, think we haven`t got fine minds, I just think the ones we do have aren`t being stretched enough.

I went to a poor comprehensive with a poorer reputation. One deputy head maintained rigid discipline for my first two years. He left and no one filled the void. I ran riot. I`ve no direct experience of grammar schools and don`t know whether I`d have passed the 11 plus. But if the old system was no better than the current one of shite comprehensives and universities in every postcode then I`ll the entire set of Trust policies. Don`t want to go all the way back to 1900 but we need to look backwards for inspiration.

You’re right about one thing - I don’t think education is a waste of time for anyone. The owners of “fine minds” will stretch them themselves, regardless of where or what they are educated. Those whose minds are of insufficient “fineness” are the ones who need the stretch. The pre-comprehensive system of grammars, technical schools and secondary moderns was just an institutionalisation of the class system. I don’t see how that was in any way better.

We`re not progressing at all here, are we ?

Karen Matthews can`t be an immoral, feckless trollop who needs a day of humiliation in the stocks outside the Town Hall, can she ?. Oh no, she`s a victim of a system that forgot sexual education.

If you don`t go to university you`re a victim of an aristocratic conspiracy.

If you don`t get to grammar school you`re a victim of the class system.

I live on a council estate in a former mining area. I went to a shit school. I`m not a victim. I`m exactly who I want to be. If you`re not, get off your arse and be what you want to be. Loads of people from the mining communities went to grammar schools. The mining communities were extremely proud of the fact. Those that didn`t did something useful. At 22 I`d rather be most of the way through a joinery apprenticeship than picking my arse in a call centre, fretting about my £20k of debt wondering why the hell I did a media studies degree and bummed on a Thai beach for a year. Horses for courses. Simple.

We`re not progressing at all here, are we?

Depends what you mean by “progressing”. If you mean “agreeing with you”, then no.

Karen Matthews can`t be an immoral, feckless trollop who needs a day of humiliation in the stocks outside the Town Hall, can she ?. Oh no, she`s a victim of a system that forgot sexual education.

Why can’t she be both, or a bit of both or more of one than the other? Why the dichotomous world view OSB?

If you don`t go to university you`re a victim of an aristocratic conspiracy.

If you don`t get to grammar school you`re a victim of the class system.

Are you seriously suggesting that education wasn’t and isn’t intricately tied up with class privilege? If so, you’re arguing against yourself a couple of posts ago.

I live on a council estate in a former mining area. I went to a shit school. I`m not a victim. I`m exactly who I want to be.

Well, bully for you. Here’s a sugar mouse.

If you`re not, get off your arse and be what you want to be.

Yes, because it’s just all so easy isn’t it?

Loads of people from the mining communities went to grammar schools.

Define “loads” as a percentage of the “community” then compare with the percentage of people who went to grammars from the stockbroking “communities”.

The mining communities were extremely proud of the fact. Those that didn`t did something useful. At 22 I`d rather be most of the way through a joinery apprenticeship than picking my arse in a call centre, fretting about my £20k of debt wondering why the hell I did a media studies degree and bummed on a Thai beach for a year. Horses for courses. Simple.

You seem to be of the opinion that I think everyone should go to university, regardless of personal desire or aspirations. Quite where you got this completely bizarre idea from is anyone’s guess, as I don’t believe I’ve in any way suggested anything of the sort. I suspect you are having an argument with the person you imagine me to be rather than the person I actually am.

You started the characterisation, imagining that you`re arguing with Col Huffington Puffington. It`s a classic, and tediously predictable, dismissal of right wing viewpoints. Very shortly I`ll morph into a skinheaded, jackbooted thug.

Why can`t Karen Matthews be both ?. Well she can, she is, and more. It`s “multi - factorial” to use the academic parlance. But this non - judgemental crap has gone far enough. Sometimes society should draw a line in the sand. Sometimes we should be judgemental. Sometimes someone should be punished to send a very strong message to the remainder of us. It doesn`t happen though and it doesn`t happen beecause of bleating apologists who have to portray EVERYONE as some type of victim.

Why this incessant whining about class privelige ?. 30 or 35 years ago Bill Gates was a student scratching his bollocks at the back of the class. His kids might be as thick as mince but they`ll get into university, any university they please. Wealth brings privelige. You can chelp all you like but that`s the way of the world. And the ones who whine the most, the Prescott`s of this world, are the first to abandon their socialist bretheren and dive into a champagne bottle on the croquet lawn the second they get an opportunity.

It doesn`t matter what percentage of people from the mining communities went to grammar school. What matters is that a good number did. It was doable. The stockbroking argument is something of a red herring. It stands to reason that, on average, those communities will have a higher IQ. Picking the bones out of that is an impossibility. But don`t moan about stockbrokers. If the jealousy is giving you sleepless nights pull your finger out and aspire to be one.

Similarly, kids from my comprehensive had interviews at Oxbridge. I think one or two got in. Most didn`t. They`d have had a better chance if they hadn`t had to contend with idiots like me. You assert that fine minds will always stretch themselves. BOLLOCKS. Peer pressure was pretty fearsome in our day but it`s savage now. Kids need pushing, they need boundaries and they need their attention diverting from mobiles, ipods, facial piercings, hair styles, clothing fashion and more.

These kids aren`t getting the opportunities they deserve and they`re not because of idiots with chips on their shoulder and outdated class hang-ups. I notice you have studiuously ignored my concerns about student debt. If I was in further education that`s what would be giving me sleepless nights not stockbroker envy. These kids are being doubly betrayed, an inadequate secondary education and further education for no good reason. Three cheers for the Institute of Education. Nice one !!.

To take your points one by one.

The characterisation was a joke, OSB. You know, not serious, flippant, meant to be humorous. Clearly, I hit a nerve. The funny thing is, I’m not some unreconstructed leftie, not in the slightest. To some people, I’m to the right of Genghis Khan; to others, I’m further left than Trotsky. I think this means I’ve got it about right.

You talk as if I am one of the “bleating apologists” for the likes of Karen Matthews. I’m not. Reasons for her behaviour are not excuses, and trying to find those reasons does not exclude making any judgement on her.

Why the “whining” about class privilege? Because maintaining it leads to a terrible waste of talent, that’s why. You may argue that there is no talent among the lower orders and they should all be happy with forelock-tugging and pig farming, but I’d disagree. Wealth brings privilege, yes, so does that mean we leave those without wealth on the scrap heap? Education for those who can afford it, fuck the rest of you? This seems to be what you’re arguing, although it’s a little hard to see through the spittle at the moment.

It DOES matter what percentage of people from the mining communities went to grammars. One group’s privilege leads to another group’s disadvantage. You may be comfortable with that, I’m not.

It stands to reason that, on average, those communities will have a higher IQ

Well, by that “logic”, the upper classes should be awash with geniuses.

You assert that fine minds will always stretch themselves

Yes, they will. Which is why it needs to be channelled into something that will benefit them. Like education.

Kids need pushing, they need boundaries and they need their attention diverting from mobiles, ipods, facial piercings, hair styles, clothing fashion and more.

Oh please. You come across as the kind of person who, fifty years ago, would have seen Bill Haley as the beginning of the end of civilisation.

I notice you have studiuously ignored my concerns about student debt.

Fees are equitable and necessary and without them, some universities will close and then NOBODY benefits. The idea that the country can go on funding higher education indefinitely is a nonsense.

And what’s your problem with the IoE now? It’s a research institute, like the Institute of Psychiatry.

Dear God

With notable, and sometimes glaring, exceptions the average stockbroker will be more intelligent than the average miner. But you`re muddying the waters. This is a mining community, there are no bloody stockbrokers. Kids had the opportunity to go to grammar school, if they didn`t get there it most certainly wasn`t because they were denied the chance to accommodate a stockbroker`s child. Once kids from this estate had a chance of a first rate secondary education. Now they don`t.

Likewise, kids from my comprehensive had interviews for Oxbridge which suggests to me that Col Huffington`s children didn`t have all the places sewn up. Of course a place can be manipulated but these are centres of academic excellence. They want talent. They need talent. The reason my contemporaries struggled to get in wasn`t to do with talent. Their secondary education wasn`t, generally, good enough and they were held back and distracted by the likes of me. The class system is not denying them their place.

You`re going wildly off track with your class logic too. Just because I`m prepared to concede that stockbrokers are more intelligent than miners DOES NOT mean you have carte blanche to extend the “logic”. The upper classes have been inbreeding since they acquired their estates after the Norman invasion. They`re not likely to be geniuses. All I`m saying is that jealousy about their wealth and status shouldn`t be impacting on educational policy.

FEES ?????????????????????. I`ve no problem with fees whatsoever. I`ve no problem with junior doctor`s working 70 hour weeks. If you`re granted something that will bring immense benefits you should work hard for it. I do have a problem with the ill educated masses traipsing to university because everyone else is going, paying their fees, accumulating other miscellaneous debt and coming out with a poor quality, worthless degree.

You`re not prepared to groom excellence for fear that someone your jealous of might sneak on to the band wagon. Your solution is for us all to swim a cesspit together. Are you upper class in denial as you`re a bit lacking in genius.

OSB - to emply a favourite phrase of yours, BOLLOCKS.

From beginning to end, BOLLOCKS!

You seem to equate privilege with ability; class with excellence. Do you really, seriously think that Cambridge admitted Prince Edward because of his academic brilliance? BOLLOCKS! Do you really, seriously think that there is a level playing field out there, and that brilliance and excellence and fineness of mind will always win through? BOLLOCKS! And you confuse a concern with equity with jealousy. BOLLOCKS!

As to the ad hominem remark, please, don’t lower yourself.

Please, please, please explain to me how my admission an Oxbridge place ” CAN BE MANIPULATED ” can possibly equate to me seriously thinking Prince Edward went to Cambridge on merit. You are jealous and it`s rather sad.

Prince Edward is a complete irrelevance. I guess you would rather shut Cambridge than allow an overpriveliged nobody through the doors. Life isn`t fair. Tough shit. No institution is perfect but Cambridge seems to have a well deserved, worldwide, reputation for excellence. ( not many British institutions can say that these days ). So they`ve had a few muppets in the ranks. Get over it. Let`s cherish the good bits.

What actually matters is the odd gem on this estate who has what it takes to go to Oxbridge. They won`t be going and if you think that`s beecause of Prince Edward you`ve got problems.

Again, OSB - BOLLOCKS.

This is going nowhere. You’ve started resorting to ad homs, so I suggest we quit it. However, I have to thank you for reminding me where my values lie.

Don`t mention it

I`ll see you when they flog Karen Matthews. Will you be the one dressed as Genghis Khan ?.

Seriously, thanks, I enjoyed that.

Zarathustra, I like your posts, worked as child-psychiatrist myself. Is it normal for you to give the results back to parent and child in the same room? I wouldn’t recommend it. I just saw “child genius” and saw prof. Freeman doing the same. It just doesn’t feel right to me. I have had angry parents or crying parents in my room, I’m glad the child was not there at that moment.

I’ll be the one knitting next to the guillotine when they behead Prince Edward, OSB. Glad you enjoyed the knockabout.

Just in time. I’m out of popcorn.

The best is observation by the CAMHS team in either the school, home or even hospital setting. I used to come up with this again and again and I do not make many friends as you can imagine. One “mother” asked if her son had ME after failing to secure ADHD diagnosis. Then she tried to snatch the file from my junior. She turned out to be a neighbour hoping to “help” get benefits.

Good catching.

Yes, I am still on Hols, but cannot let this one pass by.

Was there ever an offer to observe him at home?

I didn’t say they were obviously caring parents. I said they were desperate parents. Their recent behaviour does nothing but confirm me in that view.

I’m just acutely aware that it is very easy to get cynical about the people you come into contact with on a daily basis. I can be cynical about students, for instance. I’m also aware that professionals can imagine they have all the answers.

It was acknowledged to the parents that the boy had a problem. Presumably he would have been offered appropriate treatment. The parents were just set on one diagnosis. ADHD is one of those diagnoses that absolves parents of responsibility. I frequently see 18 year olds who can no longer get stimulants prescribed by their paediatrician and want a diagnosis of adult ADHD to continue getting them. I have yet to meet one who genuinely has ADHD. I generally advise them to seek drug counselling and psychological input for their behavioural problems but it’s a bit late by the time they get here.